095 – Making God an Idol

Cody Johnston 1:22
Hey everyone, welcome to the reckless pursuit. My name is Cody and my name is Elaine and this is episode 95. And this week, I know it’s right before Christmas, but we’re taking a break from our Christmas shenanigans. I’m sorry, we’ve talked to all we’re going to talk about Christmas this year minus right now because I’m still technically talking about Christmas. I mean, I guess it’s always about Jesus and sweet little baby Jesus in the manger and all that fun stuff. So this kinda No I can’t really make it Christmasy. But we are talking about something that is probably a real controversial sounding statement actually

Unknown Speaker 2:03
around Christmas yes

Cody Johnston 2:04
but I think that this conversation is really interesting and really needs to be had and I’m actually quite excited about talking about it and that is just the idea of not making God into an idol and that’s just like whoa you know the first commandment have no other gods before me the second one do not make for yourself and idol. How can you make God an idol? I believe you can in fact commit idolatry with God the very thing you’re supposed to not commit.

Elaine Johnston 2:37
Yeah, of God.

Cody Johnston 2:38
Right. So this is going to be an interesting conversation and so buckle up because I think this is going to really challenge I think a lot of our mentalities that’s challenging mine. Before we get into that, just a couple of quick things I just heard is not just I’m about you have an episode drops are Trying to give a timeline is right in my head. I’m about to have an episode drop. If you’re looking for Christmas and you’re just like, Oh man, I was really hoping they were gonna do some more Christmas stuff. Don’t worry, because I have an entire episode on the jolly old St. Nicholas coming out over at itinerant. Just a quick little teaser. Did you know that St. Nicholas punched a guy in the face on the Council of Nicea because he was mad at him for not believing in the Trinity.

Elaine Johnston 3:26
Whoa, I feel like that goes down now still,

Cody Johnston 3:29
literally punched a dude in the nose. Okay, there’s a whole lot I could go into there with St. Nicholas because he’s an interesting cat. But we’ll save that for itinerate so make sure to go over to itinerant podcast.com or find me on iTunes Spotify, wherever you’re listening to this. It’s there and go and click that subscribe button. And while you’re there, click the subscribe button for this show too, and maybe go leave a review on both Those shows. Hey, while you’re there, Elaine just had a great festive holiday Survival Guide come out over at the product called daughter. Elaine, tell us tell us a little about that.

Elaine Johnston 4:10
Yeah, so I’m talking about, well, I guess talked last week about self care, and just different self care practices that you can incorporate during the holidays, and just how to make time for yourself in the busy season. So

Cody Johnston 4:24
And if you’re wondering why we’re fumbling over all these timelines so much, that is because we, as of the day, this airs are literally probably pulling into the driveway from a long trip in New York. So I’m only assuming it’s going to be fantastic. We will keep you updated on all that New York has to bring will be posting to social media and stuff. And so you probably already knew about that at the time of hearing this. But let’s talk a little bit about why we shouldn’t make God an idol. This is going to be fun. Alright, so I just want to open this up by reading the difference. finition of idle we haven’t done definition oh wow easy to definitions I’m

Elaine Johnston 5:05
a year ago whenever little

Cody Johnston 5:06
baby reckless pursuit when we used to your definitions for every episode I’m sorry, okay bring it back around an image or representation of a god use as an object of worship. Alright, so how do you make God and idol? Elaine you drop this random like one liner in the middle of me having a conversation explain to our listeners What made you drop this one liner and what did I say? So I can try to reiterate it back here and I can get my thoughts in order.

Elaine Johnston 5:40
Okay, so I know this is a very like, at face value is a very like twisted and warped thing to say. But I was actually on Facebook. I feel like a lot of my conversations are about me being on social media, maybe I should just stop being on social media, but then I wouldn’t have any content. So I was on Facebook and I was seeing a lot of people Go back and forth about meditation. And what Christian meditation versus I guess worldly, really just normal meditation. Yeah, non non Christian air quote, non Christian meditation what that looks like and, and how you can there’s some questions asked about like, well, how can you meditate and worship God and not get off track or not new? Do these new age practices? And

Cody Johnston 6:27
also we’ve already talked about Yeah, yeah, sense of detail.

Elaine Johnston 6:29
Yeah. And so I was just reading some of these comments and I was just like, wow, Christians are very fearful. There’s a lot and yes, I know people in general, happier. That’s one of the biggest things that just drives our emotions and our choices and actions. But specifically with what I was reading these were all Christians or at least self proclaimed Christian. So I’m specifically talking about this. Right Christian? Yeah. So I just Going to realize that there’s a lot of fear that Christians have of not going to hell or getting off track or upsetting God or sitting and all all this stuff that I was just thinking, well, if you’re focusing on God, then you can’t mess up. You can’t get off track. Like if you’re meditating on God’s word if you’re chasing after God recklessly pursuing God, like, Okay, so how are you sitting? But then I realized they’re pursuing an idea of God or they’re maybe not even realizing that it’s a get out of hell free card or whatever you want to call it. There’s just a lot of, I guess, Miss understanding of who God’s true character is. And I was just like, Hey, I think we make an idol OUT OF GOD sometimes. And then you told me that something along the lines of like, that’s why a lot of people who are pedophiles end up being pastor.

Cody Johnston 7:56
That’s what you got out of what I said because that is not what I said. All

Elaine Johnston 8:00
that was what I heard, but I knew. So

Cody Johnston 8:04
we’re playing a game of telephone here on air. Okay, so what I actually said, let me backtrack a little bit to preface why we even got into this. I was talking about how I really liked that idea. And then we had a whole conversation with Siri about how it should become a memo and she really Bosch it over and over and over again and we lost track. Then we got back on track. But anyway, so the gist of what we were saying was, or what I was saying to us, like, I liked that idea. Because if you want to get really spiritual and really like truthful here, nothing is sinful, until it’s manipulated, right? But at the root of everything is truth, as the root of everything is God’s creation, God’s initial design, and there’s corruption placed on top of that, but to say a practice like meditation, throwing air quotes here, that’s what we were talking about. Just say a practice like meditation is sinful, is okay sure, there may be method like people prefer Meditate crimes all the time, people premeditated murder people premeditative fares and like all these other things like you can pre meditate or you can meditate on negative thoughts, you can do all these things. But that that’s a type of meditation, it’s a corrupted version, but at the root of it, it’s something God created to clear your mind to focus on. I mean, you can do something like contrapositive prayer where you’re focusing on a scripture a certain idea, it’s one of my favorite ways to pray, and to read the Bible to find something and just allow it to sink in on a deeper level by repeating it almost like a mantra or a slogan if you will over and over

Elaine Johnston 9:38
as I say, or if you have like New Age practices where you burn sage and then you’re like, God, just like speak to me like that’s completely fine. Sure,

Cody Johnston 9:44
and we get into the whole thing of like, well they used incense and stuff like that in the temples and all like that’s tradition like that’s, there’s nothing wrong with that. What’s wrong is by the mentality, you use it up. So like people being afraid of meditation because the word is Associate A new age practices Well, you’re manipulating. You’re you’re looking at a corrupt version of God’s intent. And all of these things can even the silencing of your mind. And actually, previous guests we had on Karl Karl forehand had been posting in that thread. And he said, some really cool is like, well, people were like, well, what if you clear your mind and allows for negative thoughts and Carl said it so beautifully. And I just want to give you a shout out. Hey, Carl, if you’re listening, shout out to you. He said it so beautifully. He’s like, well, if those thoughts are in you, and they’re surfacing, because you’re being quiet enough to hear them, wouldn’t you want God to deal with those things? Wouldn’t you want those to be brought up in your mind? And so like that was just like, oh, wow, that’s profound. And so we were talking about how like, everything originally was God’s and it was like, manipulated stuff, but we have all these fears. And then I said, we were talking about like ministry and people think that like these ideas of God are going to fix their fears. And that’s where I was like, that’s So many people who are now like all this stuff coming up, you know, the conversation we just recently had with marriage abuse, about sexual abuse, and especially sexual abuse in church and all this stuff of the SPC, all these different things are kind of coming to light right now. Well, that’s because a lot of ministers actually go into ministry, because they’re struggling with things and they’re trying to get away from them. And how else can you run as far away from something as to run into ministry but the thing is, if you’re not dealing with it on a heart level, you’re not dealing with it at all. And that’s where the whole thing so

Elaine Johnston 11:31
well and I was gonna say that’s where I start thinking of like, the fear and all of this stuff, making God an idol because you’re not focusing on the goodness of God you’re not focusing on truly worshipping and connecting with God, you’re focusing on I need to get this sin off me and like I just wrote all this bad stuff. I just need to get it out. I need to purge Oh, god cleanse me of this because I don’t want this there’s a true difference.

Cody Johnston 11:57
Right? And some may argue, well, that’s making an idol. Sin. The differentiator here is whenever you’re looking to this version of God, not God, because obviously God can fix it. That is the fix, right? God is the fix. But when you start looking at God as a system, you are you are now worshipping an idealized version of divinity itself. You are no longer looking to God, you’re looking at this. I mean, let’s just be really honest. It’s the difference in actually getting alone with God or actually having a relationship with God versus having a relationship with a Renaissance painting of Jesus with his fingers and the weird, contorted figure, you know, with the brown beard and looks like a surfer dude. Like, it’s you might as well be having a relationship with that picture because all you are worshipping at this point is a portrait painted by someone else. You are not connecting with who God is to you how God is speaking to you how God is speaking through you, you’re neglecting all of that and you’re focusing solely on other people’s perspectives, other systems perspectives all of this.

Elaine Johnston 13:01
And it’s, it’s, to me, I feel whenever I see people making God an idol whenever people are chasing, or whenever people are trying to run away from their sin, they’re not focusing on the goodness of God and stuff. A lot of times, it can be for show to prove to other people, hey, I don’t have the sin in my life like I’m good. Or you’re trying to not be judged by other people because of whatever instead of just being raw and real and saying, Hey, I’m dealing with this emotionally, physically, spiritually, mentally relationally, whatever. And actually dealing with the heart issue. I know. People are tired of hearing the heart issue, but that’s really what it comes down to. If you’re putting on this facade of Hey, like, I go to church, I lead church I lead worship, I’m a pastor, but you’re still dealing with these things, but nobody knows you’re like closet sending the knots whenever you make The portrait of Look at me, I’m this great Christian, but you’re hiding that real relationship that you could be having with people that you could be having with God and that you could actually be having with yourself.

Cody Johnston 14:12
Yeah, and I just want to kind of touch on a couple things you said there one of which being you said like your closet sinning, I just want to remind everyone like when we say sinning, we’re not talking about a single action, I believe that sin is is first in your thoughts and always comes in stems from your thoughts before it ever comes to an action. So sin is a is a is a mentality. It is not an action in and of itself. The second thing that’s really the thing I really want to focus on is you said like you’re running from those old things. It is a very, not wise idea, a very stupid idea to run from something. I say that lovingly. I understand, like, I just just try to fall with the analogy. If you’re driving in a car and you’re constantly looking at the in your rearview mirror, you’re probably going to either have a wreck run off the road. end up on the wrong lane heading the wrong direction, like you get turned around super quick. Just think of it this way. This is a study I don’t remember all of this exactly. I think it’s actually kind of mentioned the movie Sahara just a little bit. But if you’re always looking over your shoulder, if you’re always looking over your shoulder sooner or later, you’re going to start drifting that direction and you’re going to end up long story short right back where you started

Elaine Johnston 15:22
when it goes back to like, what you focus on what you meditate on. That’s what you become, you’re so afraid of becoming this or you’re so afraid of thinking these thoughts but you’re, you’re thinking to yourself, I can’t think these things and then those things just keep like you keep thinking about those things later.

Cody Johnston 15:39
Well, I mean, that’s the whole thing is like what you see becomes what you think what you think becomes what I will say becomes what you do, what you do becomes who you are, right? Like it’s it’s a snowball effect or it’s a U turn effect or however you want to look at it. But what you were saying it’s like don’t don’t run from something. Will the offices that run to something Yeah, chase after something. That is what we are. It’s not the, you know, the reckless retreat. It’s the reckless pursuit, right. That’s the whole name of our show. you’re pursuing something, and you’re doing it all out. And you’re not worried about all those little stumbles along the way. Because let me like, let’s just another analogy here. If you are running full charge after something, you’re going to have little stumbles, you’re going to trip you’re going to hit little snags, because you’re not focused on those little snags along the way until you’re already past them. The only time you focus on those little snags, or once you’ve already made the adjustments and kept running, because you’re so focused on the direction you’re going. You don’t give a crap about the little twigs or routes you just tripped over. Because you’re just like, I trip, I gotta get back up and keep running. And you’re so not focused. If you get caught up of like, what if I hit another route? How did I hit that route? What if I hit this route again? And I’m not saying don’t be conflated? Don’t take me, guys, come on. But what I’m saying is like, you’re so focused on the pursuit, there’s no time to look back. There’s no time to look and see like what you’re running From and that’s what running to God is. It’s a learning process along the way. It’s making those micro adjustments along the way. But it’s not stopping and contemplating and staring at the problem and trying to figure out all these different aspects already a chair this year, it’s nothing like that. It’s just you keep moving, and it’s going to all fall in line. Now, that being said, kind of taking this whole back to this thing. What are you chasing after like, okay, we can be running from something we’ve run into something you can also figure out what are you running to, if you’re running to this pre Dr. nated establishment, like for instance, if you’re running to the traditional American church, but something in your heart is saying like really I don’t feel like this church. I’m not saying all church I’m just not using this like proverbial made up church in my head right now. There’s this church and like, that’s what you’re chasing after you’re getting like, you know, air quotes here spiritually fed as much I hate that term. Like, we’ll just use it for this analogy. You’re going after that, that’s what you’re doing. You’re going there. But something’s not sitting right in your heart. You’re like, Man, this there’s something missing here or they’re not, you know, something that the pastor said. something you’re realizing like you’re seeing some of these flaws, maybe your eye. You can almost start glossing over those things and saying, Oh, well, yeah, but, and those Yeah, but start building this false image of God, this American Dream God where it’s like, I’m going to have the nice little house in the corner with the white picket fence and the kids and like, you know, a boy and a girl and all this. And I’m not dogging on the American dream, like I get all that. But you’re neglecting like, Oh, well, you know, just going back to a few episodes ago, we were talking about love God love people. Oh, well, I’m neglecting. Looking into the eyes of my fellow man and seeing God I haven’t actually had an experience with God lately. I’m just going off of these notions. I’m painting this picture from other people’s views. I mean, let’s think of it as kind of what started Protestantism in the first place is we’re like, Hey, we don’t want to look at these preconceived notions of God anymore. We want to see him for ourselves. And we can quite literally make an idol out of this false representation of God. Or let me kind of rephrase this here. You can make an idol out of someone else’s version of God. That doesn’t mean it’s an idol to them. Because that’s where they’re at in their walk, go into our episode last week about just talking, you know, dealing with family around the holidays and everything and trying to respect yourself, respect to others and respect God, you can very well make an idol out of someone else’s depiction of God because to them, they’re seeing God in their way. They’re relaying it to you, but now what do you have, you have a second hand encounter and you’re not seeing God for yourself. And that’s

Elaine Johnston 19:34
where the whole idolatry comes from, as that you have this image, this skewed image or this false image of, of who you think God is or what somebody else told you God was, but you never actually pursued that whole relationship side and actually knowing God’s character and understanding that God is within you because if you truly truly recognized that God is within you, you wouldn’t be Trying to run from all these problems are you and be afraid of getting off track or going into sin?

Cody Johnston 20:06
Well, and I just want to add to that too. And sometimes it’s not even running to or running to sin or running from sin. I want to add a little more something that’s like more relatable to me in this I we’ve been mentioning it a little bit because this is just really what God’s put on my heart lately. But whenever you start looking at like I ran, I’m talking all full force into like, hours upon hours of praying, I ran into fasting thinking that was the answer. I ran into serving my butt off, trying to do everything trying to be everyone’s epitome of what a good little church boy should be. Because I thought that was what was getting me closer to God, but I made an idol out of serving an idol out of prayer, an idol out of fasting an idol out of all of these things. And I put that before my real relationship with God. Here’s another twist to that. Whenever I was dealing with my mom, I made myself and I She could look too, because I was always relaying God to her. But I was getting in the way of her having a real relationship with herself. And that made me getting out of the way and letting her crash. Sometimes that meant me getting out of the way and letting her having to deal with her own problems. Instead of trying to fix all of her problems for her because I quite literally became her idol she started looking to me because I was showing her God but I wasn’t giving her the freedom which is good to show someone God but I wasn’t giving her the freedom for her to figure out God for herself for her to see her expression or God to show himself to her. I was kind of like blocking that out you know I was the umbrella blocking the race so god you know, didn’t have the room to shine. all that to say is you can make an idol honestly trying to pursue God. But the thing is, where’s the spirit check? Does it give does it bear good fruit? Is it feeling hard? does it bring love joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self control, or is it bringing more works more rituals, More of this more of that, right here lately, the big time I’ve been hearing God is honestly, either in studying for my podcast because I’m researching, or my quiet time in meditative contemplative, either contemplating or I’m reading over scripture and just allowing it to sink in, or just the silencing centering prayer. I’m just like, God, you are my center. And I just want to kind of touch on that a little is like, hey, there’s nothing like centering prayers, or centering prayer or meditation. Where do you want to call it a beautiful thing? Because quite literally, we are the We Are the breath of God. He’s in us. He’s in our core. So we’re just bringing ourselves back to that center, which is him. And I think that’s where the key is. Anytime you’re feeling like you’re spiritually stale. Anytime you’re feeling like you’re spiritually absent, then that’s a good time to have those checks and say, Hey, God, I’m going to stop everything I’m doing for a second. Let me just refocus. Let me take a week, a month, a year, a day, an hour a minute, a moment to reflect Because maybe I’m starting to make an idol out of how I do things toward you instead of actually pursuing you.

Elaine Johnston 23:07
And that’s why I was really upset over the fear that these Christians, were talking about the whole meditation practices. Because whenever you sit and meditate and actually, really fully recognize that relationship that you have with God and get still and get quiet, whether it’s over scripture, or quiet time, or journaling, or whatever meditative method that you have, whenever you can sit down and focus that’s where you realize what your intentions are. That’s where you realize the motives that you have in the agendas and the reasoning behind why you are either running from something or chasing toward something.

Cody Johnston 23:46
Yeah, and I love what you just said about motives, because I feel like it’s so easy to get caught up in the noise, church culture, it’s so easy to get caught up in the noise. You get caught up in the worship service or what the pastor saying today for those of us who are on the outskirts who churches in our thing anymore. It’s easy to get caught up in the way other people respond to us or the way, like even these new ways we’re reading the Bible, it’s easy to get caught up in the idea of like, Oh, I have a new perspective, or God’s revealing something new to me and neglecting. Hey, let me stop for a second and just do a I guess like a soul chakra Heart Chakra, wherever you want to call it, and be like, hey, God, what are you saying to me right now? What? Where am I making an idol out of my method, we can get so caught up in deconstructing what we’ve learned about God, that we forget to actually pursue him. We can get so caught up in reading the Bible in a new way that we neglect the good things out of the old ways or where God’s actually shining through those old ways. We can get so caught up in trying to appease a certain system, that we worship the system instead of God, we worship this false image of him instead of actually pursuing him. And that’s where it’s it takes those moments and I’m just I’m urging you if I have to repeat it a few times. I just want to urge you say the same thing, a different way to take those moments and authentically look over everything and saying is everything I am doing right now? Am I pursuing God or if I gotten off path, and when I say off path, I don’t necessarily like, you know, to go back to the analogy, keep moving forward. But make sure your eyes are focused in the right place. And someone hasn’t, you know, kind of pulled the wool over your eyes. I don’t know how you want to describe it. Someone hasn’t put up a fake image in front or told you a wrong direction. Maybe that’s a good way to put it. Someone hasn’t given you the wrong directions.

Elaine Johnston 25:32
A lot of what that you’re saying just a thought kind of resonated with me is maybe that’s why we see a lot of godless churches. Or maybe that’s why a lot of people are walking away from church because they’re not finding God. They’re finding systems.

Cody Johnston 25:46
Yeah, that’s good. And we’ve I mean, I can say, without a shadow of a doubt that I have spent more time in meetings, talking about what system is going to bring in new people or what system how many tweets Can you make to the worship service? How many tweaks Can you make to the length of the sermons and the home groups and all this? And if we spent that much time invested in just seeking God, like, like, we make it out to be something so much more complicated than it is, and pursuing God is such a simple thing, right? Like, it’s such a moment to moment simple thing. It’s as simple as breathing. It’s a second nature as breathing because it’s literally who we are. When we allow ourselves that freedom and we quit focusing on the snags, and all the tears and the thorns that try to pull us back or whatever, it becomes so natural. And sure times it’s harder than others. Tom, sometimes we have to do honest evaluations and figure out these big issues. But being honest, most of the time, it’s these little things, just these little tweaks. It’s not these big, radical life changing events. I’m sure at some point in our lives it was but where we are in our spiritual journey now that’s normally not the case. And it’s normally the show Tiny little tweaks to help things pursue Christ in a more thorough way. And I just I think this whole thing sums up the meaning of our podcasts so well, and I feel like that’s a good thing to kind of come back to because we haven’t discussed the meaning of what we are and what we do, and just kind of going into Christmas New Year and coming into 2020. Like, we’re pursuing Christ recklessly. What does that mean? It literally means that we will push and pull and fight and tear down and break down and build up and construct and deconstruct and just literally travail and just as much as we have to do to push closer to God to pursue God for who he is, not what someone else or something else, or this lie or deception of what he is, and that’s what wreck the reckless pursuit all is quite literally is and I think That’s something that we can all get behind. It’s just that we are pursuing Christ and we do not care about the consequences. You know the consequences of people thinking you’re a heretic, thinking you backslide. Thank you, you’re out on a limb, all of it.

Elaine Johnston 28:16
It’s it’s that connection and relationship that you have with God. It doesn’t matter what other people think of you whether they think that you’ve backslidden or that you’ve, you’ve you’ve fallen back on your fallen off the wagon, or if you got on

Cody Johnston 28:28
our you’re out in the deep end.

Elaine Johnston 28:30
But the thing is, God is in the deep end, God is waiting there with you and for you. But you know what I’m saying, like God is in the deep parts. God is in the deep end, he’s in the wilderness into

Cody Johnston 28:43
deep,

Elaine Johnston 28:44
he’s in the wilderness. He’s in the desert. He’s in the mountains. He’s in the valleys like he’s in your highs, he’s in your lows. He’s everywhere you’re at. But I don’t think that God is in the judgments of other people of where your journey is where you’re at on that journey, and

Cody Johnston 28:59
some It’s always been so beautiful to me and we can wrap it up with this. You know, just looking at our group, just looking at a group of nomads the whole idea of being wanderers. Jesus was baptized into His ministry has a Holy Ghost dove thing come down voice from heaven boom all that literally, you know, john the baptist, which was what Elijah reincarnated or whatever, baptize them all this stuff. This is my son in whom I well I’m well pleased. Where did she just go he disappears into the desert, to get along with God. He goes out in literally has to deal with his spiritual baggage, he has to deal with his demons. He has to face the devil. This is the satanic mentality of all these things. Like hey, you’re God, you can do whatever the hell you want to do. Like you’re literally God or whatever the heaven you want to do, I guess whatever you want to throw it, but like, it’s just like he’s having it. Like you can throw yourself off this building. You can have the angels do this and like, quite literally, he’s he went to the desert, because that’s where he’s like, hey, I’ve got a retry. And get my focus on my father without all these expectations without all this other stuff. And I’m going to focus in on my father, on God on my mother, on my, on the Creator, whatever God is to you focusing in and sometimes it takes those dark, cold, dry, uncomfortable places and I’m not using this like the churchy way. I’m saying like, it’s good to go there. It’s good to go where you’re so spiritually dry. You need these eco to come along and like prophesied over your bones because you’re just like, parched, like that’s a good thing because from there, that’s where God’s like, all right, all that other stuffs out of the way. Now you’re seeing me you’re not seeing a mirage anymore.

Elaine Johnston 30:47
And this brings me back to David Hayward, the naked pastor all of his drawings of the black sheep. As you notice, Jesus is always with the black sheep. Not all the white sheep that are poking fun and judgment and being judgmental and criticizing the black sheep or the rainbow sheep even. Yeah, Jesus is sitting with them and saying, Okay, let’s have this conversation. Yeah,

Cody Johnston 31:10
guys, what do you think? What? Where have you seen a false image of God represented in your life? What What have you done to break free of false images of God to pursue a real, real true relationship with God we want to hear about it hit us up in nomads a safe community for Christians to ask unsafe questions. Also guys real quick. I don’t know if y’all know this or not Elaine and I have another another gig where we actually make apparel. And we came out with a whole line of apparel specifically for the reckless pursuit. We are doing this. We do not make money off of this show. And we’re not even looking to make money off of this show. But that is another business we have and if any of these key terms that kind of we talked about standing out to you, we created some apparel honestly, that just spoke to us and stuff that we’re wanting to order. You in sort of like, hey, if we’re going to make it and we’re going to buy it, we’re going to share it. So if that is something you’re interested in, the links for that will be in the show notes. And you can find that on the reckless pursuit calm. And I think it’s actually the breakfast show.com forward slash remerge or you can click it in the top right corner and that does help support us a little bit as well. We love you guys and as always be brave, be bold and be reckless. We’ll talk soon.